How Deep Fakes Are Justifying Real Violence

Jason Haworth (00:00)
some real shit is going on.

People are using deep fakes to try to justify these things to make them worse and worse and all it's doing is discrediting the people in charge which might get them taken out of office eventually, but the the downstream effect and the backlash It's here forever. It's not going away

Jeremy Grater (00:16)
Yep.

This is Robots, the podcast that tries to help you use technology to be a better human. And there's a lot of people not being very good humans right now. Some of them in the White House. But we're going to talk about the use of deep fakes, particularly in what's going on with the situation in Minneapolis. There's so much to keep track of. And Jason, you're doing a much better job of keeping track of it than I am. So please catch us up on the situation in Minneapolis.

Jason Haworth (00:40)
I the news is doing a much better job of targeting me because of where I sit. you fortunately don't have to listen to the consistent news feeds coming in towards you about how terrible things are and how the world is on fire because advertisers apparently aren't trying to get Canadians to buy as many American products via a panic cycle.

Jeremy Grater (00:46)
That could be it. Yes.

froze.

Jason Haworth (01:00)
But you know, marketing, whatever.

Jason Haworth (01:02)
So we're living in a weird time and especially right exactly like it's not it's not like chaos is exploding around us all the time.

Jeremy Grater (01:06)
I hadn't noticed.

January is the longest decade of my life.

Jason Haworth (01:12)
Exactly. Well,

so the thing going on in Minneapolis, if you break it down, ⁓ the ICE is inside of Minneapolis consistently going in there trying to do bad nefarious things. And the bad nefarious things they're trying to do are they're trying to find anybody of a certain skin color or with an accent and deport them because the administration has put forward this notion that these are the things that have to occur.

And I don't think there are a lot of people that are against getting violent criminals off the street. And that's the excuse that we consistently hear. But the reality is, is that they're not taking a bunch of violent criminals off the street. They keep talking about having thousands of violent criminals that they're pulling into custody. And it turns out it's just bullshit. ⁓ They do have show lists that show, you know, 10, 15, 20 violent people in this scenario. But statistics show that

immigrants are less likely to commit crimes and less likely to commit violent crimes because They don't want to get caught up in a legal system and be deported. They tend to be more compliant. They tend to actually pay their taxes like Even though you know, we're all concerned that they're taking free tax breaks from people. That's not the case ⁓ and this comes down to a problem and a perception issue where we think immigrants are over in the country and

Jeremy Grater (02:29)
Right.

Jason Haworth (02:37)
It's just not true. are a country of.

Jeremy Grater (02:38)
I can't imagine whether it would have gotten such a crazy idea.

Jason Haworth (02:41)
Right, I mean, we're a country of immigrants. We came into the US and we colonized and we took the land from the native indigenous people. And, you know, you and I both happen to live in the Pacific Northwest. And as as a as a particular region of the country, there does appear to be at least some level of acknowledgement of that and some idea that.

we should have some shame and guilt about what our forefathers did. Now does that mean we have to own those pieces? No. However, the Trump administration and a lot of the MAGA folks are like, fuck that. Like everybody's to blame ⁓ for what we did except for us. And it's gross. It's yucky. So they decided they're going to go through and they're going to start having ICE ⁓ drop into Minneapolis and start targeting people to try to have them round folks up. And I think

Jeremy Grater (03:15)
Mm-hmm. .

Jason Haworth (03:32)
If you look at it, reason why they've chosen Minneapolis is because it's in Minnesota. It's a it's a blue state or at least the city was a blue a blue city. And we've had the

George Floyd incident happen before, you know, in the same general vicinity.

Jeremy Grater (03:47)
I'm sure Tim Walz being the governor of that state had nothing to do with that decision either.

Jason Haworth (03:50)
Right, exactly, the vice presidential candidate. So, I mean, if you

look at all the component pieces behind that, this is clearly targeting political opponents. And the president has made the citizens of Minneapolis his political opponent. He's not acting as their president. So he sent masked troops into Minneapolis to go through and try to enforce border protections. And they're making up laws

Jeremy Grater (03:57)
Yes.

Jason Haworth (04:17)
and they're making up rules and every time they go to the courts, they lose, like consistently they lose. They lose over and over and over again. And when the courts actually take up the legal precedent for these cases, they lose over and over and over again. And they're trying to win the war of public opinion. And a really effective way to win the war of public opinion is to show imagery or to demonize your enemies in such a way that creates a sympathetic emotional argument for people to look at.

Jeremy Grater (04:32)
Yep.

Jason Haworth (04:44)
Great, so we can look at Renee Goode. It was really clear that she wasn't doing anything to harm these officers. She pulled her car up, she parked, they tried to rip her out of her

Jeremy Grater (04:55)
Yeah,

that's only if you believe your own eyes, you big libtard. ⁓

Jason Haworth (04:59)
Exactly, so but they tried to

rip her out of a car that the guy that the piece of shit cop that shot her was holding his phone while doing it using a known old ice technique that they used to use on the border which is to stand in front of the car while someone's trying to yank it over and the person tries to run and they say I felt threatened and they shoot them and The rules for ice changed because that technique was being used over and over and over again to justify them killing people and we went

Hey, maybe killing people isn't the right way to do this. Well, clearly some people think it is. And the person in charge right now thinks that's the best route. And if you look at the video that was produced during that period of time, the video itself that the White House is releasing and that Trump is posting, he's posting bullshit video. Things that have clearly been AI augmented, like the whole argument about were the tires pointed at this guy, were they pointed away, how were they turned, where was he standing? He clearly got hit by a car.

Jeremy Grater (05:49)
Mm-hmm.

Jason Haworth (05:59)
It's bullshit. If you watch the raw video and you watch it go through, you can see he's not in the way. He didn't get hit by the car. He shot her not once. He shot her three times. And then when she drove away, there's his fucking video camera showing him walking towards her car, calling her a fucking bitch. And then they sit there and deny her medical attention by doctors that are right there.

Jeremy Grater (06:07)
Right.

Jason Haworth (06:26)
They start creating videos and modifying them to justify their bullshit bias lies. And you get one side of the argument looking at the raw video going, the raw video says this, and then the other side comes and says, that's not the raw video. This is the real video.

no dude, like it's nonsense. It's bullshit. You are trying to sell us a narrative that doesn't exist. And they're trying to sell us a narrative that doesn't exist because they're trying to create an emotional attachment to keep doing what they're doing. So then, you know, last week we had the murder of a male nurse who was on site filming people, First Amendment right? He's allowed to do that.

who also had a concealed carry permit, who was allowed to carry his gun with him, and was not bra-

Jeremy Grater (07:18)
Because of that pesky

second amendment thing that everybody's so excited about. Yeah.

Jason Haworth (07:21)
Exactly, not brandishing

it, not doing much of anything. He's there recording people, an ICE agent pushes a woman to the ground. He turns around while holding the camera going, are you okay? The ICE agent gets up in his face and starts pushing him and eventually takes him to the ground and they find a gun on him and nine other people hold him down. They disarm him and then one person shoots him and then another person shoots him.

And then, that same person that shot him the first time, shoots him again. He gets shoved to the ground by nine people and shot three times. He's disarmed at this point, he's got no protection around him, he is defenseless, and these fucking cowards shot him. Cowards. That's what they are. I... Look man, I have been in fights.

Jeremy Grater (08:10)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Jason Haworth (08:20)
I have had people confront me. If it was a situation where it was nine to one holding somebody down, I don't feel that threatened anymore. Like this is is crazy. And these guys are supposed to have training. They're supposed to have tactics and they're masked up.

Jeremy Grater (08:29)
Yeah.

Well, and again,

and again, going back to the Court of Public Opinion, now there are multiple AI versions of the images and events that have happened. And they even went as far as to release video of him, I believe, seven or 10 days earlier, kicking an ICE vehicle, like kicking out the taillight of a vehicle to show this terrorist, this monster, Alex Prettie Must, he needed to be stopped.

Jason Haworth (08:40)
Yes.

Right.

Right.

Yeah, it's nonsense and they're creating different narratives and there's other AI video that's out there showing him doing something else. And then the latest is that you have Don Lemon being arrested for ⁓ basically for filming inside of a church, a protest that was happening against a pastor who's also an ICE agent. So the administration comes and arrests him.

Jeremy Grater (09:03)
Yeah. The list goes on and on and on and Yep. I just saw this.

Jason Haworth (09:23)
That's not the big thing. they're a bunch of the administration's a bunch of lunatics. This, and Don Lemon's not even the story. The story is that one of the ladies that was there, they have a picture of her being arrested, and the real picture is her face going, mm-hmm, like stone cold. Like, yep. A civil rights attorney.

Jeremy Grater (09:44)
She's a civil rights attorney. believe it's Nikita,

yeah, and they keep on the Kim Armstrong.

Jason Haworth (09:48)
Yes, so Nikima Armstrong, the picture they took of her shows one thing, but the picture they released of her was completely AI augmented and she's crying and bawling and wailing. Nonsense. This has nothing to do with them trying to justify her or paint her as something bad. This has everything with them trying to justify and paint her, or not justify, trying to paint her as someone who's weak because these people came in and did this. This is just manipulating the story.

generating different narratives, trying to do things to put themselves in an advantageous position. And you know you're on the wrong side of conservative history when fucking Joe Rogan is saying, maybe this has gone too far. Maybe this isn't okay.

Jeremy Grater (10:31)
Yeah. And it's,

it's the danger here is you and I can look at that. Like we look at this slop all day long and we can do a pretty damn good job of picking apart what's real and what's not. Pretty sure we're still real last time I checked, but it's the people that can't, right? It's, it's our moms. It's the older people, the people that do not live online all day. And all they see is this picture when someone shows them and they go, holy shit. You know, and they buy it completely because they are not

I mean, trained is the wrong word. They're not used to trying to figure out what's real and what's not because this is a new world. We never had to look this closely before at an image to decide whether or not it's real. And I was just reading a study about how all of this stuff is breaking down people's trust, not only in the internet, but everything. Like nobody believes shit anymore. And this has been Trump's game kind of from the beginning is just flood the zone with as much horse shit as people can possibly consume and then flood it with even more.

so that they don't know where to turn, they don't know where to look, they don't know what to trust, so they just stop trusting everything, which is the biggest threat to our institutions, which is what they're trying to dismantle.

Jason Haworth (11:41)
I have news for everybody.

Jeremy Grater (11:43)
is this our first breaking news segment?

Jason Haworth (11:45)
news everybody. This is full indoctrination into the Putin playbook. This is exactly what Russia wanted. Russia wanted us to not trust each other. They wanted us to turn on each other. They wanted us to hate each other. They wanted us to tear each other apart from the inside. Just like we did to the Russians back in the 80s and the 90s. This is PsyOps. We're losing.

Jason Haworth (12:09)
have a dipshit in office who's easy, manipulable, who plays in the heartstrings of easy, manipulable people ⁓ in his base. And it's really obvious.

And it's easy to see and it sucks. And now we're dealing with the fallout from this because we've got people that don't trust and don't believe anything that they're saying. They don't trust the government. They don't want these things to go through. They don't want to pay their taxes. Like there's a trillion things that have gone wrong. And it's literally death by a thousand cuts of the American dream. And if you look at all the other actions that we're taking, you know, invading Venezuela, international war crime.

⁓ Deciding we're going to go after Greenland, ⁓ is one of our just a property on one of our NATO allies. We're destroying our relationship with NATO. We're destroying our relationship with Europe. Europe is jumping and they're going to create contracts with India and China. We're not we're not going to be a global superpower soon. We're going to be isolated. We're not going to be number one. And that's OK. Like we shouldn't be like we're not trustworthy. We're not reliable.

We are ⁓ doing things that are bad and we're actively embracing ⁓ the worst of our instincts. ⁓ And it's important to note that, you know, this dude's not gonna be in charge forever. He will die. And when Trump goes, his administration will go with him. There is not gonna be a Donald Trump 2.0. Nobody else is that person. Nobody else.

It's gonna tie into those pieces. Nobody's gonna be able to carry those things across. They'll try, but they won't do well. But the fracture and the damage is already gonna be done and the next administration that comes in and tries to work these pieces is gonna have a really really hard uphill battle to ever feel like they can be trusted again. Because really, they shouldn't be. Like, we've proven it. We've proven that we can't have nice things. And, cause we break shit and we don't care about each other.

Jeremy Grater (14:13)
Yeah.

Jason Haworth (14:16)
and we'll say mean terrible things and do awful stuff over and over and over again and it hurts and these deep fakes are like a really clear pinpoint example of this stuff happening in real time.

Jeremy Grater (14:30)
And it's something that we, I we've talked about this before, and this is sort of very quickly a worst case scenario that I think we were trying to kind of warn about. So, mean, while this is a very atypical conversation that we have on this show, we don't typically get this political and current eventy, but at the central theme of it is somebody is using the kinds of tools that we're talking about to manipulate the world order. Like that's...

Jason Haworth (14:47)
Yeah. Right.

Jeremy Grater (14:58)
That's insanity. That is 1980s dystopian movie theme, right? And we're living it. It's crazy to watch. It's crazy to see coming so clearly and to see it happen as rapidly as it has.

Jason Haworth (15:12)
Yeah, well, and as predictable as it is, like it's not like there haven't been people saying for the last decade that this is the shit that's coming because they have. Like, we all knew this was coming. We all knew things are gonna be used this way and nobody pumped the brakes. Everyone's just like, whatever. I guess we're gonna thumb on Louise this motherfucker to oblivion. I mean, and that's what we're doing. Like, does that mean that like,

Jeremy Grater (15:36)
Hahaha!

Jason Haworth (15:42)
we're totally fucked and like everything's gonna fall apart. Well, yeah, probably you're all gonna die. Like just get used to that fact. If you just cite to yourself every day, none of this is forever because someday I get to die. That's not a healthy way to live. Like, but it might be a healthy way to exist right now in the current chaos that is. No pain is forever. Things will break. And yeah.

Jeremy Grater (15:53)
You

No.

Well, I mean,

as long as we're this political, I'll just say like, it has been really interesting to see Mark Carney, Canada's leader, step up and really kind of like to see somebody so clearly see a power vacuum and to easily step into those shoes and sort of adopt the world leader role. Living on this side of the border in Canada, it's pretty magical to watch and to see being played, having the role played so masterfully by somebody.

Jason Haworth (16:25)
Yeah.

Jeremy Grater (16:35)
who clearly is the smartest guy in the room when it comes to how this is being handled.

Jason Haworth (16:40)
Yeah, like that contrast must be really nice to watch. mean, we've on the the West Coast here in the US, we've got Gavin Newsom, we've you we've got our we've got governors that are in these blue states standing up and being like, no, fuck that. Like, we're not doing this shit. So, I mean, it's nice to know that there's still rational actors in play. Yeah, there's there's there's still there's still. Yeah. And there's still people that are working.

Jeremy Grater (16:52)
Yeah. Yeah.

A few grownups. Yeah, there's still a few grownups out there.

Jason Haworth (17:07)
and thinking logically and empathetically, emotionally and ethically. And I think this is these are not conversations about politics. These are conversations around ethics. These are conversations around human rights and dignity. If these conversations are political for you, then you've chosen the wrong politics because holding somebody down who is disarmed by nine people and shooting them has nothing to do with politics.

Jeremy Grater (17:28)
Yeah.

Yeah.

Jason Haworth (17:37)
This has

to do with ethics, power, rules of engagement, use of force, like basic morality, right? And I'm on Facebook watching people that I know ⁓ post things and then their friends get on there and they post stuff. And some of the stuff people are posting, it's just like full on, no, they were justified to do this. That person shouldn't have been there.

Jeremy Grater (17:44)
Basic morality, empathy.

Jason Haworth (18:05)
Well, why'd you get raped? You shouldn't have been wearing that dress. Like it's all fucking victim blaming over and over and over again. And Renee Good being shot in the face and being told she can't be rendered care. If you think that's because of politics, you're an idiot.

Jeremy Grater (18:07)
Right. Yeah.

Ha ha ha ha.

Jason Haworth (18:24)
That

this and I guess if you want to break everything down to politics fine everything's fucking politics and you're gonna choose sides and you're gonna stick with your side forever, but That's not the reality because if the shoe were on the other foot This wouldn't this would be an ethical issue It would be the immoral people saying these things are happening and there does seem to be one side that gets to keep doing terrible shit and gets to feel justified in the way that they're doing doing it and the other side just supposed to put up with it

Jeremy Grater (18:33)
Right.

Yep.

Yep.

Jason Haworth (18:54)
And I

don't, this is not a politics issue. This is a right and wrong issue. And these motherfuckers are wrong. They made a bad choice. They chose to back the wrong person and they're not backing away from it because it would create an issue for them cognitively where they'd have to actually admit that they were wrong to do this thing that they see things fucking stuff up all around them. But there is hope because Trump's approval ratings right now are at an all time low.

35 % It's insane. That is the lowest approval ratings of a president ever like dude, that's worse than Nixon and If you look at the statistics behind it, he has like 85 % approval still from the Republican Party I like 10 % maybe zero for the Democratic side and it's the people in the middle that have now

Jeremy Grater (19:26)
That's ridiculous. Yeah.

Thank

Jason Haworth (19:52)
shifted back over like yeah fuck that guy they thought they were gonna come in he was gonna come in and solve the economy issue he was gonna make things cheaper prices are up things are more expensive we're killing people in the street for protesting and video camera videotaping ⁓ we're creating international conflicts invading sovereign nations destroying our relationship with NATO ⁓ enabling other strongmen like this isn't this isn't politics

This is basic human decency and one side doesn't have it. And it's on display and the rest of the world sees it and the rest of the world is turning their back on us. We are not the good guys in the planet anymore. We're not. mean, when the members of the Catholic Church, when the members of the clergy, the Catholic Church and the Protestants come out and say, tell their parishioners and tell their staff that

Jeremy Grater (20:36)
Yeah. ⁓

Jason Haworth (20:50)
They need to prepare themselves for martyrdom because what's happening right now is wrong. You have the people that are supposed to be your megaphone to your sky monster telling you that what's happening is so fucking wrong you should be prepared to die.

for this cause. To fight against the government, to fight against what they're doing, you should be prepared to stand up and die.

If that's not a clear sign that one side is good and the other side is evil, I don't know what the fuck is. And you can't chat GPT your way through this one, guys. Sorry, you can't try to bro culture your way through this shit because the bro culture is turning against them. So, some real shit is going on.

Jeremy Grater (21:35)
Yeah.

Jason Haworth (21:48)
People are using deep fakes to try to justify these things to make them worse and worse and all it's doing is discrediting the people in charge which might get them taken out of office eventually, but the the downstream effect and the backlash It's here forever. It's not going away So happy Friday go Seahawks

Jeremy Grater (22:03)
Yep.

Yeah, at

least I really wish we could have found something you were passionate about this week because you know, I don't know I don't know that you brought it I don't know that you like really showed up today. Yeah, and go Hawks go Hawks, by the way

Jason Haworth (22:10)
Football. Football. Football. See hawks. Go hawks. Yes. Yes. If you're a Patriots

fan, I wish you well. I wish you good luck.

Jeremy Grater (22:22)
I wish you the same feeling I felt the last time these two faced off in the Super Bowl man ⁓ Well, this has been the Jason show. I hope you've enjoyed ⁓

Jason Haworth (22:28)
Yeah.

I don't know, I'm probably gonna have fucking

ice on my doorstep here now for what I said.

Jeremy Grater (22:39)
No, you got the right you got the wrong skin color for that. It's gonna be fine. All right. Well Like we mentioned at the heart of this the the reason we bring this up is because of the use of these technologies to advance this agenda that is Clearly just ripping the entire world apart. So What you do with that? I don't know I guess we're right alongside you in your concerns about this if this is something you're concerned about and if you're Unaware of it. Perhaps this is open your eyes to something although

Jason Haworth (22:53)
Mm-hmm.

Jeremy Grater (23:05)
Even here in Canada, know a little bit about what's going on in the current events in the US. So I'm pretty sure everyone's aware, but I guess we're right there with you and struggling through these feelings and concerns about where this is taking us. So take that for what it's worth. I hope this has been helpful. If it has, join us again next Monday. We'll probably be a little bit less pissed off. We'll see. But you can do that at brobots.me and share this with anybody who needs to hear it. You can do that again with the links at brobots.me. We'll see you next Monday morning. Thanks for listening.

Jason Haworth (23:32)
Thanks, thanks

everyone. Bye bye.